
Re: "Engineering mathematics" in Mathcad
FredKohlhepp Jan 5, 2012 8:00 AM (in response to ValeryOchkov)Valery Ochkov wrote:
I'm not a mathematician, but I think it is wrong to Mathcad Prime apply a hint of the new Combined matrix operator "norm of a vector or matrix"
The right is: "Length of the vector or the determinant of a square matrix."
I see a lot discrepancies or apparent errors in the tooltips Mathcad Prime. I showed them to mathematicians. They say it's not just a mistake  it is so named "engineering understanding" of mathematics. Nine out of ten engineers say that the vector length is the number of elements in it. And not just because Mathcad is a function of length (v), returns not the vector length but a number of elements (components?) in vector, but because for the majority of working with Mathcad think that the vector is not a vector in the mathematical interpretation (not scalar), but simply a table column.
What do you think about this?Rather than "length of a vector" I would prefer "magnitude of a vector," (square root of the sum of the squares of the elements.) The term "norm" is confusing to me (I want to think of averages), and I tend to think of the length of a vector as the number of elements in it (as you said.)
You're right! It's confusing!

Re: "Engineering mathematics" in Mathcad
A.Non Jan 5, 2012 8:12 AM (in response to FredKohlhepp)I also prefer the term "magnitude", largely because it's less ambiguous. And the the usage of "Norm" is also ambiguous. The magnitude of a vector is one norm (the L2norm), but not the only one. See: http://mathworld.wolfram.com/VectorNorm.html

Re: "Engineering mathematics" in Mathcad
jsheehan Jan 11, 2012 8:41 AM (in response to A.Non)agreed, what also adds to the confusion is mathematic's liberal use of the word norm .. as a scalar (square root of sum of the squares) , norm as a vector normal to the plane, or a series as the normal distribution. Mathcad itself can not take all the blame

Re: "Engineering mathematics" in Mathcad
A.Non Jan 11, 2012 8:45 AM (in response to jsheehan)There is no norm for the definition of "norm".



Re: "Engineering mathematics" in Mathcad
ValeryOchkov Jan 5, 2012 8:37 AM (in response to FredKohlhepp)
Re: "Engineering mathematics" in Mathcad
A.Non Jan 5, 2012 8:30 AM (in response to ValeryOchkov)I would just call it an "array". In this case, a single column array.

Re: "Engineering mathematics" in Mathcad
ValeryOchkov Jan 5, 2012 9:19 AM (in response to A.Non)Richard Jackson wrote:
I would just call it an "array". In this case, a single column array.
"A single column array"
One joke.
Do you know that John is (an) Ambidexter?
Who?
John!
An engineer points that it is a vector, a mathematician  not a vector! See my start message!


Re: "Engineering mathematics" in Mathcad
FredKohlhepp Jan 5, 2012 10:52 AM (in response to ValeryOchkov)Valery Ochkov wrote:
And more! In Mathcad Prime! If elements of vector have different dimension can we say that it is a vector!?
If I recall, some of the mathematicans when I was in college were talking about ndimensional spaces, which would infer vectors with n dimensions. Working in a plane we use twodiimensional vectors, in space we have three dimensional vectors, so . ..
My college text, Elementary Linear Algebra, Shields, Paul,Worth Publishers, 1968, talks about vector spaces, then extrapolates to function spaces, to introduce the concept of orthogonal functions and series expansion of functions into an infinite series (Taylor series are a function space, so is sine, cosine, Chebyshev polynomials, . . .
I would argue that a vector could be a single column of any length. (This is usually where Tom Gutman or another more mathematically adept person weighs in.

Re: "Engineering mathematics" in Mathcad
ValeryOchkov Jan 5, 2012 11:27 AM (in response to FredKohlhepp)
Re: "Engineering mathematics" in Mathcad
FredKohlhepp Jan 5, 2012 11:54 AM (in response to ValeryOchkov)Valery Ochkov wrote:
OK!
I studied same Math in my University too.
What is it  a scalar or a vector or a matrix or a single column or a single row
As far as Mathcad is concerned, it's a single element arrayif you try to address it as a scalar Mathcad will take offense.
As far as I'm concerned, I'm like the accountant:
A businessman was interviewing candidates for head accountant. He presented the first candidate with a balance sheet and asked, "What were my profits?" After several minutes of calculations, the man gave him an answer. The second man, presented with the same information and asked the same question took twice as long to compute a slightly smaller answer. When the third candidate was presented with the same problem the response was immediate, "Whatever you want it to be!"

Re: "Engineering mathematics" in Mathcad
ValeryOchkov Jan 5, 2012 11:00 PM (in response to FredKohlhepp)Fred Kohlhepp wrote:
Valery Ochkov wrote:
OK!
I studied same Math in my University too.
What is it  a scalar or a vector or a matrix or a single column or a single row
As far as Mathcad is concerned, it's a single element arrayif you try to address it as a scalar Mathcad will take offense.
As far as I'm concerned, I'm like the accountant:
A businessman was interviewing candidates for head accountant. He presented the first candidate with a balance sheet and asked, "What were my profits?" After several minutes of calculations, the man gave him an answer. The second man, presented with the same information and asked the same question took twice as long to compute a slightly smaller answer. When the third candidate was presented with the same problem the response was immediate, "Whatever you want it to be!"
And other jole:
The guests are gone and the wife tells her husband: You told John that he was right. But you told Sam that he is also right. But John and Sam have had the opposite opinion. How can this be?! The husband thought about it and said, and you, my dear, are right!



Re: "Engineering mathematics" in Mathcad
ValeryOchkov Jan 5, 2012 10:51 PM (in response to FredKohlhepp)We have in Mathcad two tools in one box  a vector/matrix/tensor and an 2D/3D/Nested array.
When we work with any vector/matrix we must have ORIGIN=1
When we work with any array we must have ORIGIN=0
One typical vector by solving in Mathcad one physical problem:
One typical not vectors but 2D array (a simple colomn array):

Re: "Engineering mathematics" in Mathcad
ValeryOchkov Jan 10, 2012 11:50 PM (in response to FredKohlhepp)
Re: "Engineering mathematics" in Mathcad
ValeryOchkov Jan 14, 2012 9:00 PM (in response to ValeryOchkov)


Re: "Engineering mathematics" in Mathcad
ValeryOchkov Jan 15, 2012 5:52 AM (in response to FredKohlhepp)


Re: "Engineering mathematics" in Mathcad
ValeryOchkov Jan 11, 2012 9:34 PM (in response to ValeryOchkov)Valery Ochkov wrote:
And more! In Mathcad Prime! If elements of vector have different dimension can we say that it is a vector!? This construction must have other name? not a vector (or matrix). A set of values? A vector is a set of values with same dimention (length!).
Sorry,
I think that a classic vector can have different dimensions too. See one typical simple task from a linear algebra bellow (True, the unit for mathematicians  is like a red rag to a bull!).



Re: "Engineering mathematics" in Mathcad
ptc4412520 Jan 20, 2012 10:07 PM (in response to ValeryOchkov)Dear Sir It's mayur here from INDIA.
I am working as power technologist in Essar engineering service division.
I recently start using of Mathcad.
I have created one mathcad file for Pipe sizing and pressure drope calculation for High pressure piping.
Now how to get different result by only changing pressure and temperature and other relevant detail.
I want some exampels on HOW to use TEXTBOX.and how my equation get the input data from only textbox.
Waiting for your quick response.
Thanks,
Mayur

Re: "Engineering mathematics" in Mathcad
VladimirN. Jan 21, 2012 1:04 AM (in response to ptc4412520)Hello!
Please create new topic here (and do not forget attach Mathcad file to the meassege and specify Mathcad version you are using): http://communities.ptc.com/community/mathcad

Re: "Engineering mathematics" in Mathcad
ptc4412520 Jan 21, 2012 1:07 AM (in response to VladimirN.)hi

Re: "Engineering mathematics" in Mathcad
MikeArmstrong Jan 21, 2012 2:12 AM (in response to ptc4412520)As Vladimir said, please create a new thread and post any relative Mathcad worksheets.
Mike

Re: "Engineering mathematics" in Mathcad
ptc4412520 Jan 21, 2012 2:27 AM (in response to MikeArmstrong)how convert one unit in another unit using textbox.

Re: "Engineering mathematics" in Mathcad
MikeArmstrong Jan 21, 2012 4:06 AM (in response to ptc4412520)Have a look at this worksheet, might get you started.
Sorry I haven't got enough time to create a thread for you.
Mike
Message was edited by: Mike Armstrong

Re: "Engineering mathematics" in Mathcad
ptc4412520 Jan 22, 2012 7:24 PM (in response to MikeArmstrong)Thanks a lot.


Re: "Engineering mathematics" in Mathcad
VladimirN. Jan 21, 2012 12:57 PM (in response to ptc4412520)What version of Mathcad are you using? Mike attached the file for version Mathcad 14/15.

Re: "Engineering mathematics" in Mathcad
ptc4412520 Jan 22, 2012 7:25 PM (in response to VladimirN.)i am using mathcad 14.


Re: "Engineering mathematics" in Mathcad
ValeryOchkov Jan 21, 2012 9:21 PM (in response to ptc4412520)Mayur Patel wrote:
How convert one unit in another unit using textbox.
May be so (Mathcad 11 Server):

Re: "Engineering mathematics" in Mathcad
ptc4412520 Jan 22, 2012 7:48 PM (in response to ValeryOchkov)How to give a referance of the table to the mathcad file and how mathcad take value directly from table by giving input only.

Re: "Engineering mathematics" in Mathcad
ptc4412520 Jan 23, 2012 3:13 AM (in response to ValeryOchkov)I am not able to define Temperature in Degree Celsius in Textbox.It show the error the value shall be scaler.
Also please suggest the way for uploading the my mathcad file in this discussion for your better under standing.
hope you understand my problem.
Awaiting for your reply.
Thanks.

Re: "Engineering mathematics" in Mathcad
VladimirN. Jan 23, 2012 3:19 AM (in response to ptc4412520) 
Re: "Engineering mathematics" in Mathcad
MikeArmstrong Jan 23, 2012 3:23 AM (in response to ptc4412520)Can you explain why you need to convert units using a textbox? Just so we have a better understanding of what you are trying to achieve.
Mike

Re: "Engineering mathematics" in Mathcad
ptc4412520 Jan 23, 2012 9:12 PM (in response to MikeArmstrong)Hey MIke,
I am making the calculation sheet for pressure drope calculation in high pressure piping for power plant.
I am using textbox for adding my inputs which are in different units.
For this i am using list box/combo box.
When i am difining the Temperature in deegre celsius it shows the error THIS VALUE MUST BE SCALAR.

Re: "Engineering mathematics" in Mathcad
ValeryOchkov Jan 24, 2012 3:35 AM (in response to ptc4412520) 
Re: "Engineering mathematics" in Mathcad
MikeArmstrong Jan 24, 2012 3:38 AM (in response to ptc4412520)Can you please provide a worksheet?
Mike

Re: "Engineering mathematics" in Mathcad
ptc4412520 Jan 24, 2012 3:42 AM (in response to MikeArmstrong)sorry i am finding some problem to upload it.

Re: "Engineering mathematics" in Mathcad
MikeArmstrong Jan 24, 2012 3:44 AM (in response to ptc4412520)Click the 'Use advanced editor' in the top right corner and then you will be allowed to upload documents.
Mike



Re: "Engineering mathematics" in Mathcad
ValeryOchkov Jan 24, 2012 3:41 AM (in response to ptc4412520)

Re: "Engineering mathematics" in Mathcad
MikeArmstrong Jan 24, 2012 11:09 PM (in response to ValeryOchkov)Cheers Valery.
Mike

Re: "Engineering mathematics" in Mathcad
ptc4412520 Jan 27, 2012 7:17 PM (in response to ValeryOchkov)Hey valery can u guide me how to find dynamic viscosity of steam as function pressure and temperature.


Re: "Engineering mathematics" in Mathcad
A.Non Jan 24, 2012 5:20 AM (in response to ptc4412520)There is no way to transfer units typed in a textbox to the output variable. You will have to use the technique Valery shows, or something similar (I would use a listbox rather than radio buttons, but that's just a personal choice).

Re: "Engineering mathematics" in Mathcad
ptc4412520 Jan 27, 2012 7:13 PM (in response to A.Non)Can any one guide me how to find dynamic viscosity of Steam at particular temperature and pressure.

Re: "Engineering mathematics" in Mathcad
ValeryOchkov Jan 27, 2012 9:42 PM (in response to ptc4412520)Please (thru Mathcad server  http://twt.mpei.ru/MCS/Worksheets/rbtpp/eng/Diag4.xmcd ):
or thru DLL (see www.wso.ru)

Re: "Engineering mathematics" in Mathcad
ptc4412520 Jan 27, 2012 9:56 PM (in response to ValeryOchkov)Hey Valery Thanks lot for your reply.
I am using Mathcad version 14.Can u guide me how can i get WaterSteamPro (General) and how can i install it in my system or mathcad.
Please reply as soon as.
Thanks
MAyur

Re: "Engineering mathematics" in Mathcad
ValeryOchkov Jan 27, 2012 10:05 PM (in response to ptc4412520)mayur patel wrote:
Hey Valery Thanks lot for your reply.
I am using Mathcad version 14.Can u guide me how can i get WaterSteamPro (General) and how can i install it in my system or mathcad.
Please reply as soon as.
Thanks
MAyur
Thanks for the interest to WaterSteamPro.
All instructions are here  www.wsp.ru
You must install the program and get the access thru email orlov@twt.mpei.ac.ru

Re: "Engineering mathematics" in Mathcad
ptc4412520 Jan 27, 2012 11:56 PM (in response to ValeryOchkov)Hey Valery
How can i Referance my Excle sheet to my Equiation and How my Result direct select the value from the given table.
Suppose i want Viscosity as result i have input of pressure and temperature.
I have table in which different value of viscosity calculated according to the different pressure and tempearture.
How can i get viscosity by giving input of pressure and tempearture?
Thanks,

Re: "Engineering mathematics" in Mathcad
ValeryOchkov Jan 28, 2012 2:21 AM (in response to ptc4412520)Why "Hey Valery"?
Must be "Hey All"!
You can use WaterSteamPro in Excel too:

Re: "Engineering mathematics" in Mathcad
ptc4412520 Jan 28, 2012 2:31 AM (in response to ValeryOchkov)Hey Valery Thanks But I need editable copy because i have to calculate no. of datas.
U can send editable copyif it possible to you to my Email addres.
It is Mayur.Patel4@essar.com or mayurhardrock3@gmail.com
Thanks,

Re: "Engineering mathematics" in Mathcad
ValeryOchkov Jan 28, 2012 7:43 AM (in response to ptc4412520)mayur patel wrote:
Hey Valery Thanks But I need editable copy because i have to calculate no. of datas.
U can send editable copyif it possible to you to my Email addres.
It is Mayur.Patel4@essar.com or mayurhardrock3@gmail.com
Thanks,
Sorry, Mayur.
But I do not quit understand what do you want to get from me.
















