topic Re: Domed surface in 3D Part & Assembly Design

Domed surface

John.Pryal — Tue, 26 Jul 2022 14:55:38 GMT

Hi all, i have been trying to create a domed surface from this flat surface. I need to maintain the outside shape & draw the surface up towards the centre about 5mm up ideally with a single arc. The outside profile cannot lift off the datum on which it sits. The flat surface does not have to be used, i just figured there might be some way of pulling/dragging or distorting it using warp or free form surface manipulation but i have not managed to, thus far. I have tried boundary blend too but cannot achieve the flawless surface i require. Any ideas?

John

Re: Domed surface

tbraxton — Tue, 26 Jul 2022 16:31:31 GMT

If the shape you posted in the picture represents the boundary of the surface on a plane then you can not "dome" that using a single arc of constant radius. Can you sketch a view of what the 3D "domed" surface should look like? With a 3D representation of the goal I may be able to offer some options.

Re: Domed surface

kdirth — Tue, 26 Jul 2022 17:58:33 GMT

This is a swept blend to point tangent to "rim" and smooth at top. To get the best surface, the sharp points needed to be excluded. A more controlled version could be made with a revolve. If you are looking to loft it to the outer edges, the result will be much "dirtier" with the varying perimeter and sharp points.

Re: Domed surface

Patriot_1776 — Tue, 26 Jul 2022 19:00:54 GMT

Hey John. I'd try this approach, it gives you curvature continuous (instead of merely tangent) to the flat outer rim, AND it gives you drag handles in the boundary blend to adjust your tangency to the rim and to the datum plane at the top. If it has to be a defined radius, then this wouldn't work. BUT, for that you could revolve the top and connect them with a boundary blend and then adjust the curvature as needed. I've included both models and the image is from the -01 model with the entire dome as a B/B and not the defined radius. Have fun!

Re: Domed surface

Patriot_1776 — Tue, 26 Jul 2022 20:24:22 GMT

Actually these was some weird glitch with the B/B on the first -02 part, this one works better, the drag handles in the B/B actually work now.

Re: Domed surface

John.Pryal — Wed, 27 Jul 2022 12:21:01 GMT

Thank you for the replies. I have attached a model which better shows what i am trying to achieve. I am reasonably happy with it but i realise it could be better around the indent.

John

Re: Domed surface

pausob — Wed, 27 Jul 2022 15:37:41 GMT

Since I tried it, might as well share this approach:

1) basic shape

2) old-school radius dome feature:

3) edges need to be flat, so overbuild

4) add variable-section Sweep:

Sweep is surface with a cross section that of a single spline, with curvature on the dome side and tangency on the end of the flat ledge side:

5) Solidified result:

5) Reflection analysis:

Re: Domed surface

tbraxton — Wed, 27 Jul 2022 15:51:30 GMT

As @pausob has mentioned a radius dome and you have asked about "pulling" the surface I will mention some hidden feature creation tools in Creo. These are legacy Pro/E features. There are several that may be useful in this exercise. It will depend on how much direct control you need on the resultant topology. The Push, and both dome options have potential applications here.

Set this config option to access all of the features in the all commands list below.

allow_anatomic_features configuration option yes

Several advanced features are available to deform or alter (tweak) the surface of a part:

•Local Push—Deforms a surface by pushing or pulling on a circular or rectangular region of a surface.

•Radius Dome—Creates a dome on a limited region of a surface.

•Section Dome—Creates a dome from sketched sections.

•Ear—Creates a protrusion that is extruded along the top of a surface and bent at the base.

•Lip—Creates a lip on selected edges that can be used for interlocking parts. This feature cannot be created as an Assembly feature, but the dimensions on mating parts can be controlled through relations.

•Toroidal Bend—Bends a selected solid, surface, or datum feature in two directions to produce a toroidal or revolved shape.

•Spinal Bend—Bend an object about a curved spine by continuously repositioning cross sections along a curve.

•Solid Free Form—Tweaks a surface by dynamic manipulation.

•Bend Solid—Bends solids or curves using the references of a flatten quilt feature.

•Flatten Quilt—Flatten surfaces by transformation.

Re: Domed surface

John.Pryal — Thu, 28 Jul 2022 07:23:52 GMT

Would you be willing to share the part so i can better understand your approach? I was trying to work with the 'old school radius dome' feature but could not get it to work.

John

Re: Domed surface

pausob — Thu, 28 Jul 2022 15:06:54 GMT

Yes, I post the model here. I also included a similar variable sweep based model where the radius dome was replaced by a simple revolve:

Basic idea is to use the 2-rail sweep instead of boundary blend - to make the blend surface...

Also, the style feature:

is probably the best tool PTC offers for this job - it has the capability to generate G3 continuous surfaces.

Re: Domed surface

John.Pryal — Fri, 29 Jul 2022 09:47:19 GMT

Thank you for spending time on this, unfortunately your surfaces are not quite what I am trying to achieve. I created something very similar with the 'dome feature' myself but it does not yeild the required result. If you look at the model I posted you may notice a small 4mm radius running all the way around from the outermost edge. Your model steps up abruptly from the outside edge creating a visible lip. I need a smooth transition from outside edge to dome as in my model, I just need the surface around the indent feeding into the dome to look a little better. I am sure our fitters here will be able to polish out any flaws in this area on my existing model, I was just hoping they would not have to. I have been working long enough with this software to know its limitations and figured that what i require cannot be achieved using standard Creo functionality, just hoped I had overlooked some different approach. The 'style tool' could hold the answer but unfortunately I do not hold that license.

Thanks again for trying.

John

Re: Domed surface

Patriot_1776 — Mon, 01 Aug 2022 19:04:40 GMT

I think PTC should revive and expand on some of these great old features, ESPECIALLY N-sided Mesh

Re: Domed surface

Patriot_1776 — Tue, 02 Aug 2022 22:27:29 GMT

Hey Paul! I took your .igs file and played with it a bit. From what you did, there's a couple things you can try. It's kind of hard to reverse-engineer something without knowing what it's SUPPOSED to look like (i,e, is the CAD model actually what is REALLY desired, or just someone's stab at it?). So, I did it one way in the -04 model (as if you swept a constant arc out of the dome), but then something completely different in the -05 model (pictured in green - my fave) that ended up pretty smooth but a little different towards the bottom. Yours in is grey in the upper right Anyways, this was a kinda fun diversion, thanks!

2022-08-02_johns_dome-05.prt

Re: Domed surface

Patriot_1776 — Thu, 04 Aug 2022 21:39:53 GMT

Tried something else, like this the best, it drives any small distortion into the smallest areas.

Re: Domed surface

TJ_10603709 — Mon, 27 Feb 2023 13:14:00 GMT

Great conversation! This was a big help to me thanks.

Re: Domed surface

BHOoi — Tue, 28 Feb 2023 03:56:13 GMT

Hi, John. I created this part using your iges file. I attached here for your reference see if this gives what you wanted to achieve.

Re: Domed surface

Bogdan_M — Fri, 21 Apr 2023 16:39:07 GMT

It can be done in Sheetmetal using Punch Form. You can control the dome by radius or height.

If you want a solid model not Sheetmetal one, you can use the Sheetmetal part to cut the solid.

Sheetmetal Part

Solid model

The model has 20mm rise which I control it thru the die part.

Die part it is a simple revolved part .

Re: Domed surface

Patriot_1776 — Fri, 21 Apr 2023 18:08:10 GMT

Yes, but John wanted specific conditions at the notches. Look at my post from Aug 4.