topic Re: Creo 4.0 - component selection in 3D Part & Assembly Design

Creo 4.0 - component selection

mcestnik — Fri, 30 Nov 2018 17:03:51 GMT

Hello everyone!

I have a problem understanding the selection filter in Creo 4.0 assembly mode. By default the filter (in assembly) is set to geometry and I was wondering If anyone has an explanation - Why did they implemented this change?

What is the benefit?

Why would anyone want to select geometry on assembly level?

I couldn’t find any benefits but I did notice that this change caused an increase in number of clicks for most basic operations ( like component selection ).

For example in Creo 3.0 if I wanted to select and activate a component that was on the inside of an assembly ( behind other components).
Clicks:

Right mouse button (until desired component is highlighted)

Left mouse button to select the desired component

Right mouse button - Activate

Creo 4.0
Clicks:

Select selection filter

Change the selection filter to part

Right mouse button (until desired component is highlighted)

Left mouse button to select the desired component

Right mouse button - Activate

Select selection filter

Change the selection filter to geometry

I know that with holding the Alt key I can bypass geometry filter. But the problem is that pressing and holding the alt key selects (FEATURE or part). So when holding the alt key and pressing right mouse button first all features are highlighted and then at the end componets are highlighted. So instead of just a click or two it can happen that I have to click more than 40 times + (depends on the complexity of the part) to select a desired component…

I also tried to define my own selection filter ( in file – options – selection ) and added only part to my filter. At first that seems to work fine, but it causes “problems” in other areas. For example activating a component in an assembly still leaves the selection filter on “my filter” ( part ) so I have to change the filter back to geometry to edit a part feature…

Any thoughts on this subject?
Is there a way to change the behavior in assembly mode back to the way that it was in Creo 3.0 ( without recording mapkeys)?

Is there a way to set option that with pressed ALT key only components are highlighted ( without features)?

Short video showing component selection in Creo 4.0:

Video Link : 7526

Re: Creo 4.0 - component selection

Chris3 — Fri, 27 Oct 2017 05:51:34 GMT

I haven't played with it yet, but it might be related to this:

Improve selection sequence‌

It wouldn't surprise me if they tried to fix one thing and broke another.

Re: Creo 4.0 - component selection

mcestnik — Mon, 06 Feb 2017 12:10:51 GMT

It seems that product idea for improving selection filter that is posted above was taken into account.
Selection of geometry on part level is improved - the selection start with the first thing under the mouse and then shows items as they would be encounterd moving through the model ( surfaces first ).

The problem is that the same selection filter is set in assembly mode. Who would want to select geometry on assembly model and for that sacrifice component selection with right mouse button?

Re: Creo 4.0 - component selection

Chris3 — Mon, 06 Feb 2017 12:32:39 GMT

You can setup your own filter with whatever filter selections you want and then set that as the default:

Re: Creo 4.0 - component selection

mcestnik — Tue, 07 Feb 2017 07:31:21 GMT

Thank you for your answer, but as I wrote in original message:

"I also tried to define my own selection filter ( in file – options – selection ) and added only part to my filter. At first that seems to work fine, but it causes “problems” in other areas. For example activating a component in an assembly still leaves the selection filter on “my filter” ( part ) so I have to change the filter back to geometry to edit a part feature…

So if I activate a component in an assembly - with my own filter (part) it stays set on "my filter". In Creo 3.0 if I activated a component it changed to smart and it was easy to pick geometry.
Now in Creo 4.0 it is necessary to set filter back to geometry or bypass it by pressing the ALT key.

Re: Creo 4.0 - component selection

psobejko — Tue, 07 Feb 2017 13:46:55 GMT

I don't have Creo 4.0, but I used the pre-release beta.

There was new way to click on an edge in the component, and a menu popped up. One of the items shown in this menu was "hierarchy tree" that showed the edge, its parent feature above that, then the feature's parent above that, etc.., up until the component. Am I wrong in thinking you could use this to activate the component?

Re: Creo 4.0 - component selection

mcestnik — Fri, 10 Feb 2017 07:09:52 GMT

You are right and this works great for components that are on the outside (external components) of the assembly.
But if the assembly has internal components it is very hard to select an edge or any other geometry element on that internal component - in this case hierarchy tree sadly doesn't help...

Re: Creo 4.0 - component selection

Chris3 — Fri, 10 Feb 2017 12:47:51 GMT

Have you tried opening a case to see if this is intended functionality?

If so then I would suggest you open up a product idea.

Re: Creo 4.0 - component selection

mcestnik — Wed, 15 Feb 2017 14:14:48 GMT

The case was opened ( Case Details: 13543125 ). I am waiting for their response...

Re: Creo 4.0 - component selection

kschinkowsky — Wed, 12 Apr 2017 20:55:41 GMT

Any news on the issue? I have the same complaints as you. For now I've defined my own filter as part, activation requires either I reset it or start diving into the model tree...

Re: Creo 4.0 - component selection

mcestnik — Fri, 14 Apr 2017 06:19:35 GMT

Yesterday after two months of waiting I got the response:

The Case is under investigation and I'll get back to you ASAP.

So for now there are no new news on this topic. My questions for tech support were:

Selection filter in Creo 4.0 assembly mode is by default (in assembly) set to geometry. Why was this change implemented? What are the benefits?
What is the recommended procedure for selecting internal components (in graphic window) in a Creo 4.0 assembly?
Is there a way to change selection functionality back to as it was in Creo 3.0? If not yet, are there any plans?
Pressing the ALT key while selecting components selects features or parts (features have priority). Is there a way to change the priority so components would be first to highlight?
Setting my own default filter and adding only part to selection does the trick. But when activating a component while filter is set to »my filter« (part), filter stays set to »my filter« and only component is available for selection. Is there a way to set that the filter while activating a component would change to component level filter. If not yet, are there any plans?

Re: Creo 4.0 - component selection

dgschaefer — Mon, 17 Apr 2017 20:31:04 GMT

I haven't used Creo 4 much yet, I'm curious - do you have highlighting on or off?

Prior to Creo 4 that changed the default selection methodology. With it on, you'd get the "smart" filter which, in part mode, highlighted features first and then, once a feature was selected, would highlight geometry. In assy mode, it highlighted parts and then once a part was selected, geometry would highlight.

With prehighlighting off the smart filter wasn't available and I'm not sure what the default selection order is as I rarely use it.

Re: Creo 4.0 - component selection

TomU — Mon, 17 Apr 2017 20:38:54 GMT

The smart filter has been removed from Creo 4. I will try to find the documentation....

Re: Creo 4.0 - component selection

TomU — Mon, 22 Mar 2021 00:16:28 GMT

https://support.ptc.com/appserver/cs/view/solution.jsp?n=CS258654

Tutorial: Geometry-Based Selection and Mini Toolbar

Here's some other random stuff from the Creo 4.0 sneak peek:

Re: Creo 4.0 - component selection

EyalChaki — Sun, 23 Apr 2017 15:21:33 GMT

Hi Matevz & All,

The change in selection paradigm in assembly Creo 4 was intended.

The reasons for that are several ones.

- The desire to allow both future creation and editing which can be achieved today (Creo 4) with geometry selection, the mini toolbar and the dual context.

- Pre-selection highlight issues that were raised by a lot of users on having parts as the default selection filter in assembly.
(I've heard of a lot of users that turned off pre-selection highlight before Creo 4)

I do agree that in some cases, if you want to query into the model by parts, the current default filter would be less efficient and that's is why you can either switch to a part filter or use Alt (which I know has a lot of other selectable objects)

What if we do the following changes?

- Make in assembly Alt+LMB select only parts

This will allow easier access to parts but will require switch to feature filter (as before for feature selection in graphics).

Thanks,

Eyal Chaki

Technical Fellow, Creo User Experience

Re: Creo 4.0 - component selection

mcestnik — Mon, 24 Apr 2017 11:41:28 GMT

Hello Eyal Chaki!

What if we do the following changes?

- Make in assembly Alt+LMB select only parts

This will allow easier access to parts but will require switch to feature filter (as before for feature selection in graphics).

I totally support this change and I think that suggested change would solve all the inconveniences with query into models by parts.
Probably most of ( if not even all ) other Creo users would agree with me.

Matevz

Re: Creo 4.0 - component selection

TomU — Mon, 24 Apr 2017 14:18:06 GMT

Eyal Chaki‌, I think it's important to minimize the number of situations where multiple simultaneous key presses are required to accomplish a single action. (Think drawing dimensions, measure tool, etc.) Many of our users have mapped the CTRL and ALT buttons directly onto their mice so they don't have to keep their second hand on the keyboard. With Creo 4 it has become increasingly difficult to get the correct buttons pressed. For example, in order to select multiple components from an assembly they need to hold down two buttons (ALT + CTRL) plus right click to toggle until each part highlights. In the past they just needed to hold down one button (CTRL.) We also have a similar issue with those who use 3D mice. They like to keep their left hands on the 3D mouse all the time but more and more are being required to lift their left hand and move it back to the keyboard. I'm not sure if someone with only one hand could really even use Creo anymore...

Re: Creo 4.0 - component selection

TomU — Mon, 24 Apr 2017 14:23:56 GMT

I'm not sure if someone with only one hand could really even use Creo anymore...

Maybe that should be part of the internal usability testing. Give the testers a standard 3-button mouse, tie one of their arms behind their back, and then see how they do at modeling, creating drawings, measuring, etc. Is it even possible to do all the normal tasks (without customizing the mouse or the interface?)

Re: Creo 4.0 - component selection

mcestnik — Tue, 25 Apr 2017 06:05:16 GMT

I agree with Tom. In my opinion the "old" functionality with smart filter and no multiple keys was way better.

But in this situation if I had to choose between pressing the alt key to query select into parts or change the filter manually every time and then change it back, I would choose the extra alt key...

Re: Creo 4.0 - component selection

jselland-2 — Wed, 05 Jul 2017 18:32:42 GMT

@EyalChaki Can a selection ORDER be added to the filter definition? I think this would help.

Also, STOP ADDING CLICKS/KEYSTROKES TO OPERATIONS! Tell your boss and your boss's boss.